Salem, IL: UP/C&EI Railyard, Roundhouse and Sand Towers

Railyard: (Satellite, it still has most of its tracks.)

Roundhouse: (Satellite)

Normally, a roundhouse would get first billing. But Don's explanation of how sand towers used to work gets first billing for this railyard.

Don Murray posted
This is the old sand tower at Salem Illinois. The sand was shoveled from the fenced area into the tower. You built a fire in a large pot belly stove that had a cone around it. You shoveled the wet sand into the cone. As it dried it sifted out the bottom of the cone onto the floor and then you shoveled it into a tank and then applied air pressure to blow it up into the top of the tower with the dust billowing out of the roof. I hated that duty. Finally got a tower that used silica in a hopper and did not require shoveling. Salem fire department was allowed to burn this down for practice.

C&EIRHS shared

Chicago & Eastern Illinois Railroad Historical Society posted
Ariel view of C&EI Salem Yard from the cover of the May, 1945, C&EI Employee Flyer.
From right to left is the rip track, turntable and roundhouse, with shops behind, water tower, sand house, and coal tower.

The above cropped to get better resolution

Don Murray posted

Salem Illinois pit tracks looking south from the back track.

Early 80's I think.

Dennis DeBruler commented on Don's post
I noticed that you can still see the "land scars" of the roundhouse.
https://www.google.com/.../@38.649113,-88.../data=!3m1!1e3

1938 Aerial Photo from ILHAP

Street View, May 2024

Street View, May 2024

Street View, Nov 2022

Jon Martin posted
Salem, Illinois   Union Pacific today.

Leland Dean Fultz: Probably was originally the Chicago and Eastern Illinois. C&EI was fully dieselized by 1950.

In 1968 my Uncle Dale Bean allowed me to run two C&EI GP35s back and forth in the salem yard.

Warren Caudle posted the comment:

To the NE of Centralia IL, is another smaller Midwest "city", Salem, at the junction of the B&O, Chicago & Eastern Illinois, and the Missouri-Illinois Railroads. The C&EI had a large Roundhouse, NE of Salem. Not sure when it was removed. Today, this yard is the UP main from Texas to Chicago, and is fairly busy. A county road, # 22. North from US Highway 50, or East Main Street, will put you nearly in the yard. Stay alert!! You cannot access the Roundhouse area.

https://www.google.com/.../@38.649181,-88.../data=!3m1!1e3

This was on the branch that went South to the Thebes Bridge and the Joppa Coal Plant.

Bill Molony posted via Dennis DeBruler

Mattoon, IL: LSC Communications is closing a rail served plant

(3D Satellite)

LSC Communications is a printing company. "LSC closing three plants in Mattoon ill, Strasburg Va, and Glasgow Ky. And they are al rail served." [A Lukas Irons post]

And yet they had a "NOW HIRING" sign up just a month ago:

Dec 2019

It looks like a rather modern, green-field facility.

Satellite

If a printing company can't keep this plant running during a strong economy, then the internet is killing the paper industries. Or as Mattoon Mayor Tim Gover put it: “While we acknowledge that closings and cutbacks have been a trend in this industry for some time as digital media and communications have outpaced traditional print communication, it does not alleviate the sting of this news.” The company calls it aligning the manufacturing footprint with industry trends. [MyWabashValley ]

Knoxville, TN: CSX/L&N and NS/Sou (Sevier+Coster) Railyards and Southern Depot

NS Seiver: (Satellite)
NS Coster: (Satellite)
NS Knoxville City: (Satellite)
CSX West Knoxville: (Satellite)

See L&N Depot for a topo map of the area.

The shortline Knoxville & Holston River (KXNR) operates the former Southern spur that goes along the river. It also has trackage rights so that it can reach all of the yards except for Seiver.

Will Dunklin posted two photos with the comment: "John Sevier Yard, Knoxville Tennessee, Southern Railway. (now Norfolk Southern). The old postcard c. 1915. The aerial view is 2016."
Dennis DeBruler In today's world of PSR, it is worth noting that this yard has a hump.https://www.google.com/.../@36.0368723,-83.../data=!3m1!1e3
Will Dunklin Yeah, back in the early '80s a friend and his wife had their first house a block north of this yard. Apparently the sound of a hump yard is not really conducive to a good night's sleep!
Dennis DeBruler Just a few hours after I wrote the above, I learned in another post that this hump has been closed:
Âaron Bryanţ: NS removed the hump at John Sevier Terminal, in Knoxville. All the yard tracks just come to a dead end on the west end of the yard now. So crazy.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/201024117511516/permalink/312630439684216/

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Micah Turner Photography posted

Nothing much was happening here outside of a yard job and an inbound intermodal.

Tim Starr posted
The Southern Railway built a new roundhouse at East Knoxville / John Sevier Yard in 1924. (Calvin McClung Historical Collection)

Tim Starr commented on his post
Another view of the roundhouse and machine shop under construction.

An earlier roundhouse.

Rick Shilling posted
c1898 Southern Railway 16 Bay Roundhouse, Knoxville, Tennessee.

 

Richard Shulby commented on Rick's post
GREAT SHOT!- Although I believe this is of the first SR roundhouse in Knoxville, on the north side at the SR Costa shops and yard. Per Sanborn, it originally had 23 bays and was enlarged to approx. 37 bays. I believe it was demolished in the latter 1950s. The current roundhouse in the aerial shot is at the John Sevier yard on the east side of town, and is only half the original size of approx. 32 bays (see 1916 postcard).

I saved the hump yard image because CEO's fixation on the Operating Ratio is killing freight car service. Hump yards may become about as rare as roundhouses.
(Just about an hour after I typed those words, I read this comment on a post:
Âaron Bryanţ NS removed the hump at John Sevier Terminal, in Knoxville. All the yard tracks just come to a dead end on the west end of the yard now. So crazy.

Satellite

When looking for the Knoxville City Yard, I noticed that the Blue Slip Winery might have been Southern's depot. Then when I noticed the platform roof and lineup of passenger cars, I'm pretty sure it was the depot.

3D Satellite

Update:

One of ten photos posted by Timothy Carroll
At Knoxville TN union station

William Cody Memmer posted

This is not my picture!

An Arial view of the NS Yard in Knoxville TN. As of 2016 it has been decommissioned and is being torn apart. I have recent pictures coming soon as I can get to a computer.

Matthew Bolyard What is the heritage of this.

William Cody Memmer Matthew Bolyard it was the Norfolk Southern hump yard in Knoxville but they just built a bigger one in Roanoke so this one is obsolete.

Justin Gillespie There wasn’t a bigger yard recently built in Roanoke. The NW had a hump yard there as well. When the Southern and NW merged they both stayed open, yet recently they were closed.

R Daniel Proctor posted two photos with the comment: "Coster Shop coaling tower demolished, Knoxville, Tenn., April 28, 1953."

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Dennis Mize posted four photos with the comment: "Sept. 26, 1971  Knoxville, TN  John Sevier Yard."

Dennis Mize shared

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Sept. 26, 1971 John Sevier Yard Knoxville, TN. Turntable and 7 remaining stalls of roundhouse still in use. Photo reprint by Dennis Mize.

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Sept. 26, 1971 Engine terminal, John Sevier Yard, Knoxville, TN. Southern TR2B 2454, a 1,000 hp "calf". SD45 3154, SD24 2514 and SD35 3020 are on a refueling track. Photo reprint by Dennis Mize.

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Sept. 26, 1971 Sevier Yard, Knoxville, TN. Old 100 Ton steam wrecker 903003 is parked near the roundhouse. Reprinted photo by Dennis Mize.

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Sept. 26, 1971 Sevier Yard, Knoxville, TN. Smoky Mountain RR GE 44 Tonner parked outside the roundhouse and up for sale. Photo reprint by Dennis Mize.

Louisville & Nashville Railroad Historical Society posted two photos with the comment:

Willoughby--1959 and 1983

Knoxville, Tennessee was a major railroad center in its day, although the closures and/or downgrading of facilities has diminished its importance these days. Just north of the former L&N West Knoxville yard there's a crossing of CSX's KD Subdivision with Norfolk Southern's main to Chattanooga and Atlanta. Thanks to a slide taken by an unknown photographer--but purchased online by Steve Forrest (who generously made it available to the L&NHS) --we have an image of L&N No. 33, the southbound "Southland." This once prestigious passenger run between the Midwest and the West Coast of Florida (via ACL's Perry Cut-off) was just a couple of months from discontinuance when this shot was taken in April 1959. Nos. 32 and 33 were merely daytime runs on the L&N between Cincinnati and Atlanta--coaches only (with a utilitarian "rolling buffet" so its patrons at least wouldn't starve to death or survive on water) and head end traffic. Two E-units were usually the power, as was the case this day. E7 No. 793 was the lead unit on this run.

The interlocking tower was an L&N operation (usually the last railroad to an at-grade crossing had to supply the interlocking controls, and any maintenance or staffing as required). This was a pipe-connected facility, and most likely an "armstrong" control mechanism. You can see the leverman/operator silhouetted in the window. The pipes extend to signals and/or switches as necessary to control movements across the "diamond" for both railroads. Today, it's an "automatic": first come, first served.

I was at the same location on April 2, 1983. By this date, the L&N had become part of Seaboard System. This southbound coal train had been having engine trouble but finally managed to get through the mountainous territory to the north. The middle unit appears to be the problem, with the head brakeman taking a look under the long hood of the former Clinchfield SD40.

Of course, the tower was long gone by then. The billboard advertising Knoxville's 1982 World's Fair dates the shot, although the fair had closed by that time. I understand the crossing at Willoughby is not exactly the safest place to watch trains these days, due to bad actors who just might want to knock you in the head, steal your money, and your camera---or worse. I doubt that was the case in 1959 when someone caught L&N 33 on film.

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Crest Hill, IL: (Joliet, IL:) Railcar Repair Facility Closed/EJ&E Crest Hill Yard

Actually, this is in Crest Hill instead of Joliet.

I capture a satellite image of this location because the cars are now being removed since Railway & Industrial Services is closing. It will be interesting what this looks like a few years from now.

Satellite

The realtors are trying to sell it as a rail-served industrial site.

This property, owned by Railway & Industrial Services, Inc., has been in operation for three generations and includes five buildings (office and industrial) totaling approximately 78,000 SF. The property’s in-place infrastructure provides immense additional value, including heavy power, piping for compressed air, oxygen, and propane for distribution throughout the site, as well as six miles of railroad track on site. Additionally, the sale includes three 40-ton Industrial Brownhoist locomotive rail cranes. The property’s valuable industrial amenities will enable an owner/user to immediately utilize this highly productive site. [HilcoGlobal]

Bill Molony shared the HilcoGlobal link.
Jack Morgan They have an original IC chocolate brown/orange (City of New Orleans) passenger car in there, I just noticed it a few months back. Anyone know what else they have, besides a whole line of EJ&E cabooses?
Bill Molony They had an Illinois Central tavern-lounge car on the property; that car should go to a museum somewhere.
Michael Q Quagliano Bill Molony there is a lot of stuff in there the J was holding on to for “salvage units” that could go to a museum.
John Sheskier I saw a eBay bid for an EJE caboose that was there. Starting at $10k.
Cameron Tester No wonder they've been on a scrapping spree lately.

John Sheskier We've been pulling cars out of there bit by bit. I wonder what's gonna happen with all the cars that aren't good to go on the rail.
Mike Rizzuto John Sheskier i would guess scrap on site?
Halsted Pazdzior John Sheskier do u go back there to pick up or do they bring them out to around east bridge?
John Sheskier Halsted Pazdzior they've got two tracks down there for us. One is for pulls, and the other for spots

From the comments, they have a former-Soo SW1200.

Jacob Diorio posted two photos with the comment: "MRIX 1204 lives out the rest of its days at Railway Mechanical Services in Crest Hill. This SW1200 was built as MNS 34 in May 1965 and still wears SOO candy apple red. 1/30/20"
Adam Elias Man I wish this place would’ve been droned before the scrapping spree began. I remember seeing a lot of cool stuff in here when I was younger.
Dillon Harrison At one time, There was almost an entire fleet of EJ&E 500 and 100 series cabooses along with I believe 2 Massive wrecker cranes... To my understand, IRM tried to work a deal to Atleast save a crane but the cost was too high and RIS wouldn’t budge.
Alexander Phillips Greed...when they shut down, they gave the workers no notice...they didn't even get to finish the day!

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John commented on his post
This was the only other interesting thing I found. Everything else was well cars.

Rick Vetter posted four photos with the comment: "EJ&E 003 scale test car in Crest Hill, IL."

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Owen Sound, ON: Great Lakes Elevator

(Satellite)

Barry commented on his post
Here is Saginaw off loading at Owen Sound - Oct 4, 2018.
Dennis DeBruler This shows what I noticed in the satellite image, the elevator is very wide: seven silos.
https://www.google.com/.../data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4...

Crystal Rydall Hogg posted, cropped
Saginaw unloading at Owen Sound grain dock.
[According to some comments, it used to take two days to unload with the marine leg. Now, with self-unloaders, it takes just 12 hours.]

Good Noise posted
"Toy Grain Elevators" - I think the tilt-shift effect works better in this one.

John Fearnall shared

Barry Westhouse posted
Great Lakes Elevator Company at Owen Sound, Ontario. - Aug 9, 2019.
Chris Evie Evans The water is very high this year [2019]
Bob Summers Is this facility still active? Do not see spouts to load the ships.
Barry Westhouse Ships come to unload / Trucks come to ship out & deliver.
Bob Summers Understand - Ship in, truck out. Appreciate seeing waterfront view. Any rail?
Barry Westhouse Rails have been gone 25 yrs.
Bob Summers Kinda like in the US, Barry Westhouse Railroads are very particular about the business they are willing to do.

It appears that the railroad has not only abandoned the elevator; it has abandoned the entire region.

AJ Grigg Aban RR Map

Master IoqY, Oct 2017

Keith Ruhl posted
Owen Sound Harbour 1952

Wayne Brown

The Norgoma was still steam powered with the taller smokestack.

Tanya Waltenburgh

What is the name of the first ship right in the front?

Melanie Hammond McArthur

It's the Norgoma. It was in the Owen Sound harbor July 10 this year. It was having work done. They are/were owned by N. M. Paterson and Sons. They used to have a big letter P on their stack, but now you can spot them by the bear inside a red circle.

Marie Kovacs Miersch Hassard

Yep...when we were kids, soooo many boats in the harbor eh!!! 

Keith Ruhl

[I didn't realize there was that much shipping on the Great Lakes before the Seaway was opened in 1959.]

Chris Evie Evans shared

A reflection off of the sound seems to be rather common.

Chris Evie Evans commented on Barry's post

Chris Evie Evans posted three photos with the comment: "Owen Sound Ontario Canada on a cold winter day."

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Chris Evie Evans shared
Jack Daw That is a classic-looking lake freighter!

Chris commented on Jack's comment
Yes it is one of the older classic lakers.
Here is a picture of one of my Grandfather's ships back in the 70's. It's not the Owen Sound Grain elevators in the background. I'm not sure where the pic was taken. The ships name is The Parker Evans

Larry Broadbent posted
CN 4526 ready to leave Owen Sound. The Howard F Andrews in it's winter berth in the background. March 1982
Jim Griffin Is that a MoPac box behind the second unit? I remember taking photos of box car logos in Owen Sound and was amazed at the variety of American roads that turned up there.
Eric Potter It is a Detroit Toledo & Ironton boxcar behind the second locomotive. Now part of the CN system.
Leslie Reading I do not remember the Howard F. Andrews but I do remembers the Oakglen and Spruceglen. Those ships had class.. Oh, sorry. I forgot this was a train page, not a ship page. I am just an overall transportation guy.
Chris Evie Evans shared

Chris Evie Evans posted three photos with the comment: "Owen Sound Ontario, Canada today."

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The Miller Cement Terminal is on the right.

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Tee Kathy I guess all the other ships have left.

Chris Evie Evans commented on Tee's comment on a post
 We only had 3 ships this year over winter. My family owned a shipping Company back in the 60, 70 and 80's. Here is a picture from the late 70's.

Chris Evie Evans commented on Tee's comment on a post
Early 70's

Chris Evie Evans posted
Road salt delivered today in Owen Sound Ontario.
Bob Summers Salt production is a major industry here [I think Bob is from Kansas.], but the salt they produce here is white. Looks like the grain elevator is for ships?Chris Evie Evans Bob Summers yes, the grain elevators are still being used for ships. I believe it's only running at 50% capacity.Brenda Jim Winans Why is it green?Bob Summers Rust inhibitor added
Tee Kathy also, is the silo active?

Chris Evie Evans commented on Tee's comment
Yes, the elevators are still being used. Not as busy as back in the day when my Grandparents owned a Great Lake Shipping Company, Hindman Transportation

Barry Westhouse commented on Chris' post
I was in Owen Sound today and saw the Mississagi off loading her cargo of treated road salt.

(This photo was supposed to be further up in these notes. But a Google bug put it at the bottom of these notes. Instead of wasting my time working around a bug that I reported weeks ago, I leave the photo here as a monument to Google's bug.)
Good Noise posted

"Overflowing" - Another shot from Saturday evening's visit to the Saginaw unloading at the Owen Sound grain elevators, this time from my drone. At first, I didn't know what was going on, but then I realized that the section that the boat was filling was full, so the grain had nowhere else to go but down and out.

Funny that I've lived here all these years and had no idea those were chutes on the side of the elevators. Even funnier that I actually worked unloading the grain boats in the early 80's and 90's and didn't know.

My best friend's dad, Donny McMillan, was in charge of the crew that unloaded the boats so whenever I was available, I would help. But it was a very different experience than this.

Back then, the elevator's leg (you can see it inside the tall shaft on the left of the building) was lowered into the hold of the ship. The leg has rotating buckets inside of it that scoop up the grain. Once the leg got to the bottom of the hold and could no longer scoop the grain, our crew was called into action.

Our first job was to shovel off the walkways that ran down the side of each hold. Then we climbed down to the bottom of the hold, which could be 5 or 6 storeys tall.

At that point, we set up 2 pulley systems using some very thick ropes and giant shovels - 1 on each side of the leg. Donny and his father, Albert, sat above the hold and ran the shovels back and forth, pulling grain towards the leg. Our job was to grab the rope and pull the shovel into the corners, etc. until all the grain had been moved to the leg. At that point we would shovel the last of the grain into the leg. Then we moved onto the next hold.

Looking back, it was quite an amazing experience. But it was very hard work. We were given masks to wear, but they made it even hotter so we rarely wore them. This meant lots of grain dust in your lungs and nose for the next few weeks. The only other thing I remember was Donny telling us to stay away from the shovels and to NEVER step over the ropes as they could rip us in half.

At the time, we were paid about $140 for 2 long days of work, which I thought was great at the time. But remember, minimum wage was $3.15/hour.

Shortly after my working there, the crew was replaced with 2 small front loader machines that were lowered into the hold to scoop up the grain to the leg. I'm not sure if the leg is used at all anymore. But, again, perhaps someone with more knowledge than me can let us know.
Bob Elder Those hoppers on the side were added after 1999. They were installed to handle self unloaders. With the leg if you had an overfull bin it was an internal spill. The cement on the dock was poured just for this reason.Bob Elder At one time the 2 inch nylon ropes were 1 inch wire ropes. Can still remember Coy Currie teaching us how to splice both the wire and nylon ropes. The loaders never replaced the huge metal shovels, they were put in to cut down on the unloading times. These vessels operate on quick turnaround s to make as many trips in a season as they can. Used to take 40 some hours to unload, with the skid steers it came down into the 30's or high 20's. As the lady said 18 hours to unload this vessel.Bob Langlois I still remember falling off the top rung of the internal ladder after we had it down to the skin... landed flat on my feet some 40’ below (?) My teeth are still rattling.Mike David We were unloading grain screening pellets which are used for feed. It is pelletized dust and it is the worst product to handle/unload. They don’t flow so that’s why they kept backing up the hopper. If you zoom right in you’ll see me standing on the hatch cover 7 from the right haha. We also haven’t used the marine leg in quite a few years. When I started there we used the shovels with the ropes and once we got down to the “skin” we dropped in our 2 skid steers. Near the end of using it we didn’t use the shovels and lowered in an excavator. Once down to the skin we would drop in a backhoe and one skid steer. The excavator was key for those unloads. Much quicker and safer than those big steel shovels. Unloaded quite a few ships with Donny. Great guy. The “grain gang” were still around when I started. Anyway, this pic is a beauty shot. That was a long night.Todd Hillyer Mike David I remember going down there with you and moving the block and pulleys for the shovels. I could barely reach some of them. Then going down with our own brooms and shovels to clean up. Then I got to run the big shovels and was always a little scared sitting over the hold looking down. That was a long way down. LOLDave Brown That old elevator is still next to the fastest for unloading trucks. Under 15 mins for a set of B trains 44 ton and gone. Not many modern elevators are able to

Linda L. Baker commented on the above post
My nephew, Rowan Morris is the Second Mate aboard the MV Saginaw. We went over for a brief visit on Saturday as they were unloading and he explained the whole procedure to us....too complicated for my brain! He said it usually takes about 18 hours for the self unloaders to empty the hull but they were very efficient and were able to leave for Toledo earlier than scheduled.

Barry Westhouse posted
The Great Lakes Elevator Co. Ltd., Owen Sound, Ontario. - 02/03/2021
Dennis DeBruler: Since the ship does not have to go through the Soo Locks from here, is it still shipping? Or is it tied up here for the Winter?

Barry commented Dennis' comment
Algoma Innovator is there for winter layover.

Barry commented Dennis' comment
Owen Sound is a place for winter layover - Feb 2015 with Algomarine & Saginaw.

1 of 10 photos posted by Bruno Puntz Jones

Classic Laker Alert!!!

M/V Saginaw of the Lower Lakes Towing fleet in beautiful Owen Sound, ON, on a picture-perfect Sunday 23 October 2022. The last time I was here the Sydenham River it was frozen over and M/V Frontenac was the object of my desire that day. This day was better though, I had my ace co-pilot with me for the ride.

Saginaw [3] is a self-unloading bulk carrier that was built as hull #417 by the Manitowoc Shipbuilding Co., Manitowoc, WI for the American Steamship Co. (Boland & Cornelius, managers), Buffalo, NY. It was launched May 9th, 1953 as the John J. Boland (3) and is one of three near sister vessels built by this shipyard. The other two vessels are the John G. Munson built as hull #415 for the USS Great Lakes Fleet still actively sailing, and the Detroit Edison built as hull #418 also for the American Steamship Co. It is owned by Lower Lakes Towing Limited and is sailing under the flag of Canada with its homeport being Port Dover, ON - where I was one week ago today!

Its current draught is reported to be 6.8 meters. Its length overall (LOA) is 193.02 meters and its width is 21.95 meters. It is powered by a MaK 6M43C 6-cylinder 8,160 BHP diesel engine spinning a newly installed controllable-pitch propeller.

Sources: marinetraffic.com, boatnerd.com

Melanie Hammond McArthur shared several drone shots posted by David Strutt of three ships in winter layover in 2021.

Chris Evie Evans posted three photos with the comment:

Owen Sound Ontario

O.S. Fire Department testing the ladder truck water cannons.

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Chris Langlotz posted
Michipicoten discharging grain at the Owen Sound elevator.
[Comments indicate this photo is probably older than 2020.]

Steve Briggs commented on Chris post

The port handles sals as well as grain and cement.

Shane Ruther posted three photos with the comment: "Algoma Intrepid in Owen Sound."

Jon Davis: That green salt is the worst to unload.

Nicole Evans-Beattie: Jon Davis how come?

Jon Davis: Nicole Evans-Beattie it be crazy sticky. If you look at the last picture of the cargo holds you can tell that salt ain’t movin.

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Comments on Shane's post